WWII anti-fascist film holds up disturbingly well

Like most folks, I’ve spent some time thinking about the flare up of white nationalist violence last weekend in the United States. For me, this is a disturbing continuation of trends we’ve seen in all corners of this country. Division, threats and death.

What do I think? Why recreate what was so well articulated 74 years ago:

Don’t Be a Sucker” (1943) by the U.S. War Department:

If you’re too impatient to watch the film, this is the description from the U.S. Archives:

Like “The House I Live In,” this film warns that Americans will lose their country if they let themselves be turned into “suckers” by the forces of fanaticism and hatred. This thesis is rendered more powerful by the ever-present example of Nazi Germany, whose capsule history is dramatized as part of this film. There’s a great deal of good sense in this film and more than a bit of wartime populism: “Let’s not think about ‘we’ and ‘they.’ Let’s think about ‘us!’

Comments

  1. Interesting government issued clip…a bit dated but vividly explains why Trump won the vast majority of counties across the country, including 81 of 87 in Minnesota.

    After eight years of Obama policies, we’re well down this track, Hillary would’ve sealed our fate. Fortunately, the country said “no, enough” and like the man in the film, tore up eight years of b.s…and put Trump in charge. But with the nothing but resistance from the Democrats, the Deep State and the media continuing to pit us against one another, continuing to spew biased, fake news…the battle is a long way from over..

    • independant says:

      I agree the established government bureaucrats (deep state) are terrified of loosing any power and the vast majority of the media is absolutely loosing their minds. Up until about a month ago I would watch about a half hour of MSNBC and about a half hour of Fox News if I had a little time at the end of the night to catch up on national/global issues from two different perspectives. It was a little difficult to get through some of the BS on Fox about Pres. Obama when he was in office but to try and get any actual information in between the wailing and screaming about Pres. Trump now on MSNBC is impossible. Our news outlets playing to one demographic and creating a hyper partisan powder keg it fueling the problems we have. I wish they could do more straight reporting on both sides and less sensationalism for the good of all of us. Unlike what most talking heads on these programs would like you to think, 99% of people don’t hate you or anyone else and they are also not the root cause of the problems in your life.

      • A Anderson says:

        People really should try PBS. They have interesting segments on what people in all areas of this country think about what is happening. Thoughtful commentary by conservatives and liberals. Sometimes you have to think outside the box a bit. I also think MPR tries hard to give all sides a voice, much to my dismay. Why does it all have to be cable news?

      • Indeed..

      • Just a minute. Are you two guys suggesting that the neo-Nazis and Klan members carrying Trump posters along with their swastikas and Confederate flags were in the right, or are you just way off topic?

        • You’re mired in the swamp Gerald. Obama started this we/they, black/white, cops are bad, rewrite history divisive crap eight years ago and is sitting back & enjoying the fruits of his evil labors. With the path we’re on, there soon will never have been a civil war…all evidence, all monuments, will be gone. What’s next, the Roman Colosseum?

  2. So then you are also joining in the argument that the neo-Nazis and Klan should not be condemned? This is really bringing you guys out of the weeds.

    Even Trump has had the good sense to drop the argument you are making, albeit on the second try, an extremely rare reversal for him. Most Republicans — Sessions, Homeland Security Advisor Tom Bossert, Hatch, Rubio, McCain, Grassley, and many others, as well as all law enforcement officials, both local and national — have all specifically condemned the neo-Nazis, Klan, and white supremacists immediately and continue to do so. Perhaps they are influenced by the fact that over 30 of the counter protesters were hospitalized and the only Nazi hospitalized was hurt fighting a cop. And of course, only a neo-Nazi decided to charge his car into a peaceful crowd leaving the scene and killed someone — something well documented on film. Or perhaps they just realize that the fascist terrorists are totally un-American, and it is time to put a stop to all that before it goes any further.

    The neo-Nazis and Klan are domestic terrorists, pure and simple. Some of the counter demonstrators realized in advance that they were going to be attacked, and came prepared to fight back. I don’t endorse that, but to suggest there is a moral equivalency is to embrace moral bankruptcy. No one in either party with any sense or responsibility disagrees.

    Certainly, as the judge who ruled in favor of allowing the storm troopers to demonstrate said, you guys all have the right to support the Nazi agenda. However, since it is no longer necessary to do so to defend Trump, who has adopted the anti-Nazi position himself now, you can now safely indicate that you condemn white supremacists, the Klan, and the Nazi’s. If you don’t want to do that, or if you want to take a position that “mistakes were made on both sides,” you are free to do so. Hopefully, you will remain a tiny minority.

    • If you want to condemn groups such as the neo-Nazis and others, then you must also condemn groups such as BLM and Antifa. They all should be investigated. End this absurdity of trying to connect the Republican Party with the Ku Klux Klan, it was a creation of the Democrat Party. And I seem to recall Senator Robert Byrd of West Virginia, infamously known as a grand wizard of the Klan, lauded over at his memorial by Barack Obama, Bill and Hillary. It was Senator Byrd who was vehemently against the Civil Rights Act of 1964, but it was Republican Senator Everett Dirksen who supported its passage.

      • Norshorguy says:

        Ranger, does this equivocation apply to liberals and conservatives equally? Or just Liberals when it is convenient for overdeveloped sense of disingenuousness? Can I count on you to always model such behavior in the future? As for Bob Byrd, he very publicly regretted his past behaviors, but your good friend Strom Thurmond quite famously stated that he didn’t have any regrets or anything to apologize for. And it was also your good friend Kevin Philips (Nixon’s Chief Election Strategist in 1968) that said:

        “From now on, the Republicans are never going to get more than 10 to 20 percent of the Negro vote and they don’t need any more than that…but Republicans would be shortsighted if they weakened enforcement of the Voting Rights Act. The more Negroes who register as Democrats in the South, the sooner the Negrophobe whites will quit the Democrats and become Republicans. That’s where the votes are. Without that prodding from the blacks, the whites will backslide into their old comfortable arrangement with the local Democrats.”

        That sure sounds like a “Southern Strategy” for Republicans. Shall we continue?

        Ranger, you seem to be who the Porter in Macbeth was talking about: “Faith, here’s an equivocator, that could swear in both the scales against either scale;”

    • David Gray says:

      Apparently Gerald wants to bring back the House Un-American Activities Committee.

      The Klan and National Socialist guys are scum. Just like the Antifa guys who’ve been beating people up for some time.

      But what about the angry leader who inspires violence? By all means denounce Bernie Sanders whose follower shot a member of Congress.

    • independant says:

      All Neo-Nazi, National Socialists, KKK are dirt bag losers who are pathetic and sad. For you to suggest anything I said was in support of them is gross. Even groups that support ideas I hate have the right to free speech without violence. The violence needs to be stopped on both sides immediately and I feel that the far left and the far right have many folks in the middle fooled. Why are we not talking about job growth and rebuilding infrastructure in this country after it was a main topic of the campaign? Working folks are getting played.

  3. Independent, I agree you did not endorse the neo-fascist like others, but just got sucked along off topic following some of R-47’s comments without really agreeing with him on the main topic. I agree with your points in the above comment.

  4. The goons at “Stormer” were doing hand flips from joy when Trump gave his lame “both sides” pronouncement, and correctly so, because it went along with the notion that their behavior was part of a reasonable response. Now he has had the good sense to stop that nonsense and denounce the murderous white supremacy movement and all its tentacles. As long as mainline conservatives keep up the idea that the white supremacists are just another example of differences of opinion, we are heading down the path that the film clip warns against.

    If you are a white supremacist, fine. Otherwise, stop weaseling around and denounce them forcefully.

    • David Gray says:

      I’ll denounce the Klan. They are nearly as evil as the people running Planned Parenthood. That is hellish indeed.

  5. I agree Gerald. If you are a white supremacist, white nationalist, sympathetic to KKK, nazi and fascist ideologies, own it. After all, the white supremacists proudly left their hoods at home to go to Charlottesville with the intention to intimidate and physically hurt anti-protesters. Walking around with torches and dressing like Trump on the golf course, khakis and polo shirts shouting KKK slogans was just the start. The next day they came in militia gear, helmets, sticks, shields, mace and several dozen armed with assault rifles. They openly beat people with sticks, sprayed chemicals and spit on them and threw urine on some.
    Trump’s and his administration’s actions are far more important to pay attention to than his words read from teleprompter script yesterday. He has “a lot of words” that he never means.
    Trump administration is cutting funding for groups fighting right-wing violence, making changes to DHS grant programs supporting efforts to stop violent extremism and recruitment. One example is cancelling $900,000 grant that would have gone toward U of North Carolina, Chapel Hill, to counter jihadist and white supremacy recruiting.
    If Trump is serious about denouncing white supremacists/nationalists, he will denounce and root out the tentacles in the White House, past and present, Steve Bannon, Stephen Miller, Sebastian Gorka, Rich Higgins, Julie Kirchner, Mike Anton and more. Trump has never been hesitant to attack and criticize people, name names but he is noticeably quiet or praising Putin and other dictators, even inviting murderous dictators to the White House. No previous president or presidential campaign has been connected to white supremacists and Russians, unprecedented.
    It’s unamerican and unpatriotic if one can’t unequivocally and loudly disown white supremacy/fascists or foreign countries infiltrating our government.

  6. Let’s be fair and balanced, the issue is more so –

    “As long as mainline liberals keep up the idea that the BLM, Black Panthers and Antifa are just another example of differences of opinion, we are heading down the path that the film clip warns against. If you are a libtard or multiculturalist, fine. Otherwise, stop weaseling around and denounce them forcefully.”

    Obama promoted politics of racial fragmentation on his watch; he repeatedly spewed broad generalities about American racism. He shunned opportunities to tamp down leftist racial radicalism. He made excuses for riots in Ferguson and Baltimore. He used the shooting of Dallas police officers by a radical black activist as an opportunity to lecture Americans about the evils of racist policing. He knew divisiveness of his actions, look where he’s brought us.

  7. I think former Representative John Dingell said it best: “I volunteered to fight Nazis 73 years ago, and I’ll do it again if I have to. Hatred, bigotry, and fascism should have no place in our country.”

    Everyone from Orrin Hatch to the Pope has denounced the white supremacist behavior. Even Trump has denounced it, in an incredibly rare reversal of his position.

    If you endorse white supremacy, just come out and say so.

    As kissa says, own it. Stop trying to bury it in a blur of irrelevant distractions.

    • I’ll admit, a lot of my friends are white (and probably most of yours). And some are organizing. They’ve heard some leftist zealots are threatening to tear down the statue of Daniel Greysolon, Sieur du Lhut which sits on the UMD campus. It’s been revealed that ole Daniel, a French nobleman, soldier and explorer, was also a slave owner back home. In addition, he might have killed a local Indian or two. Are you willing to join ’em in defending Daniel? Or, are you on board with initiating a contest to rename Duluth? Just come out and say so, which is it?

  8. Ranger, you’re only position (entertainment) is if someone sounds like a liberal to you (or libtard as you so much enjoy saying), you’re instantly, automatically against whatever that person says and the icing on the cake is you think you annoyed that person. Trolling to try to enrage liberals and get attention seems a pretty lonely game to me.

  9. John Dingell is great on twitter. Too bad Dems can’t clone him.

  10. Gerald really called it ….”bringing you guys out of the weeds”. I would not be surprised to read Ranger’s foolishness on some crazy right wing blog, but I was somewhat taken aback he would be so blatant on this blog And of course Mr Gray never misses an opportunity to spew his snark on sexual issues, especially on LGBT and women’s rights. A perfect example of the insecure , white , middle-aged (or older) Conservative male.
    The matter of creeping fascism is not a difference of opinion. History books are replete with the insidiousness of the techniques employed through the ages to sway the hungry, unemployed,and yes, uneducated masses. I wonder how much destruction will have to happen before Trump supporters wake up. Will it be in time?
    I wake up every day wondering what fresh hell awaits. Trump gave license to all the bigots and fascists to come out long before he lurched into the presidency. His vile speeches, filled with crudity, misogyny, physical threats ,bigotry were throughout his campaign. Maya Angelou said,” When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time”.
    I am not going over all the previous remarks by Ranger and Gray. Gerald , Kissa, and Independent , to some degree, have covered the bases very well.
    Here is a gripping video of this past weekend’s tragic events.. It is 22 minutes long, and should be a warning to any person who cannot see the difference between opinions ,and very dark threats to our democracy.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P54sP0Nlngg

    • Back to where we started. The eight years of darkness Obama has bestowed upon us is beyond belief. But we can thank God we’re blessed every morning anew in the fact Obama’s out, Trump’s in charge and Hillary is another day older.

  11. Hi Mr. Ranger47! Could you please, please, please give up on the Hillary thing? It’s over, it’s done – time to move on there. If you can actually refrain from saying “Hillary” or referencing her in any way on Aaron’s site until at least January 1st, I will personally donate $100 to the local church of your choice. Sometimes I just stop reading here because of your unhealthy need to endlessly comment and on Hillary Clinton. Aaron seems to know you, so I know he could set this up! It would be better for all of us to not have to listen to it anymore and better for you to let it go! You in? Can you do it?

    • Forgive me Amy but I’ve just been so overjoyed since Wednesday, Nov. 9th, 2016 at around 2:30am that I can’t help myself. That day was so glorious, not so much for me, but for my kids, grandkids, you and our nation.

      That said, you’ve got a deal!

      Her name will not be mentioned again by me, nor will I make any reference to her, on Aaron’s blog until at least Jan. 1, 2018 as you ask…maybe longer.
      The church of my choice for your donation is either the church you attend…or Bethel Lutheran, Bovey. Bless you!

      Now, here’s a offer for you. If you promise to stop watching ABC, CBS & NBC news and watch FOX news only for the next three months, I’ll donate $100 to a local school, or school event, of your choice. You in?

      • Great! Thank you!!! I would take your offer, but to be honest I don’t really watch too much national news on ABC, CBS or NBC already, maybe only a few times per month. But yes, if you’re still offering, I would be willing to watch FOX 21 instead of WDIO 10 and FOX cable instead of any other national station … I’ll go until January 1st also. So no more ABC, CBS, NBC, CNN, MSNBC, etc for me, and no you-know-who for you! Thank you! I’ll check in with you soon.

  12. independant says:

    This isn’t about white supremacists and this is not about Antifa. Let’s say you have a group “A” and group “B”. Lets say group A has ideas that are intolerant and they are willing to physically attack you if they do not like what you say. Group B is an even more intolerant group and believes anyone who disagrees with them from group A should be beat down physically before they have the chance to speak because in their mind allowing group A to speak cannot be allowed. Okay, now tell me, is group A Antifa? Is group B the white supremacists? White supremacists are garbage we all agree on that but do they not have the right to free speech as much as we cannot stand what they are saying? Should vigilantism be allowed? If so against who and for what reasons is it ok? If you want to call people Nazi sympathizers because they don’t completely agree with you take on a situation and throw that term around like a sloppy drunk you are the uneducated. You may need to look in the mirror and take a pause because this issue is not as simple as it looks in the world of Facebook.

    • No. There were/are actual Nazis and Klan members here, regalia and all, spouting their hate. It is incumbent on everyone to denounce them, since they are not only repulsive in their own right, but also represent the antithesis of American values.

      There are only two sides here: Nazis and Klan, and those who oppose and denounce them. It should not be a hard choice. As I recall you did denounce them earlier, while R-47 has refused to. That is probably not surprising in view of his past posts.

      No one here is defending Antifa, and I hereby condemn any group that uses violence. I do not denounce groups that demonstrate peacefully to oppose Nazis and the Klan, and encourage them to do so at every opportunity. As I said above, there are only the Nazis and the Klan and those that oppose them, and it is not a hard choice.

      As it happens, Jeff Sessions, the FBI, the White House Homeland Security Advisor, the Virginia State Police, the Charlottesville police, Senators Hatch, Rubio, McCain, Graham, Grassley, Portman, Heller, Gardner, several others, and many GOP representatives all have said that the Nazis and Klan were at fault in the incident. The National Review, Commentary, the Wall Street Journal, and several other right wing news sources also agree. The chief of police of Charlottesville gave an extended interview, in which he described his plan to create a cordon through which the demonstrators could march safely with the counter protesters on the other side of the cordon. He reported that the Nazis and Klan violated the cordon immediately, starting at the park where they were supposed to assemble and continuing throughout the parade route, repeatedly leaving the designated area to rush and attack counter demonstrators who at most were taunting them as they chanted their anti-black, anti-semitic, and anti-American slogans. As I noted earlier, all of the significant injuries were to counter protesters except a single white supremacist who was injured fighting a policeman who was in full riot gear.

      The police chief concluded that many of the white supremacists were there not to speak, but to engage in violent attacks, and came well equipped to do so.

      Since everyone who has had access to law enforcement information about the incident and all the reporters who were present agree on the events, anyone who claims to have information that disagrees can have it from only one source: the Klan, Nazis, and white supremacists themselves, hardly an objective or believable source.

      Yes the Nazis, Klan, and white supremacists do have free speech, but they do have to stay within the rules of allowed parade and public gatherings, and the are not allowed to violate those rules to physically attack people who are also exercising their own right to free speech.

      And of course they do not have the right to kill people, as they did in Charlottesville.

      • independant says:

        http://www.latimes.com/nation/
        This LA Times article may be a good one for you to read Gerald. Both sides full of idiots initiating violence. Not one sided at all. Remember this isn’t about having to pick one side or the other.

        • independant says:

          http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-charlottesville-witnesses-20170815-story.html

          This is the correct link to the story. Witnesses from all possible slants.

          • Interesting article. One — exactly one — person other than admitted white supremacists says that she witnessed two white supremacists being attacked, being hit by signs. Everyone else says that some of the counter protesters RESPONDED to the attacks of the white supremacists with FIGHTING BACK. The main account of action in the park and elsewhere by a counter protester makes it clear that their actions consisted of shouting at the white supremacists.

            This all lines up very well (except of course for the Nazis’ own statements) with what everyone says. Counter protesters almost entirely limited to shouting and and the Nazis attacking shouters. The description of the car attack makes it clear that it was unprovoked aggression.

          • independent says:

            Gerald. You most certainly did not read the article. Did you skip over the news reporters account of an elderly man with the white supremacist group getting his head bashed in with clubs by a couple antifa members for starters… I’m going to have to step away from this conversation as you seem to miss the macro.

          • Independent, I think it was you who did not read the article. The report about the old man being bashed with sign sticks, not clubs, was from Isabella Ciambotti, a U VA student, and is clearly labeled as such. It is not by a reporter. I did, in fact note that in my summary. She is the only person who describes any assaults by the counter protesters. Otherwise, no one who is not clearly a biased witness describes the counter-protesters and doing anything but yelling, and in a few instances fighting back when attacked. Ciambotti does not describe how the white supremacists, including the older man, happened to end up in a crowd of counter-protesters, separated from what was already described as a a very disciplined and well organized white supremacist group.. We also don’t know much about Ciambotti or how she happened to be in the midst of the melee, or whether she was part of either group, and for that matter where she found a “group of strangers” to rescue the older man.

            So the gist — if you actually read it — is that only a single potentially neutral observer characterized the counter protesters as attacking the white supremacists, and that was an isolated incident.

            As I said, this ties in well with the observations of law enforcement officials who are the source of the information that caused a large number of Republicans, including administration members, to conclude that the white supremacists caused the problems. the description of the automobile attack makes it clear it was totally unprovoked and is clearly murder.

            This all fits with the most objective measure of all: 18 counter protesters hospitalized with injuries from the car attack, one dead, 14 other counter protesters hospitalized with other injuries, one Nazi hospitalized following his attacking a policeman who fought back.

      • Just to confirm Gerald – I renounce the devil and all his works, all his ways.

        • Still being evasive, I see.

          • Evasive only to those lacking a Christian & moral understanding of good & evil.

          • David Gray says:

            You must bear in mind that Gerald has a strong alternate reality which is impervious to authoritative sources of information.

          • Norshorguy says:

            Mr. Gray, this is interesting point coming from the guy who said the counter protesters were short on permits. Irony is not your friend today.

  13. A very poor trade-off , Amy for a measly $100… IMO.

    • I’ll miss Renee Passal the most . I really like our local WDIO news – I think we have a great station for our small local market. But I can do it until January 1st – Dan and Nikki on FOX 21 are OK, too.

  14. Amy, he’s just trolling. He’s not actually politically serious. It’s just a deflection game to him attempting to outrage people to get his kicks. He’ll never put up and shut up.

    • Pretty rash statement for never having met me kissa.

      Amy strikes me as honorable and I take her at her (I assume, but regardless) word. Assuming Aaron knows who Amy is, I’m willing to send him the $100 to hold. And at the end of the year, if she says she lived up to her end of the promise, the money is hers to use as we’ve agreed. She’ll be a changed (more aware) person.

  15. As to Ranger, I will repeat Maya Angelou , “When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time”. Some of us have ” known ” him for quite a long time.
    And to Independent, this IS about picking one side or the other.

  16. It shouldn’t even be a question of picking a side. That just blows my mind. How in blazes do people think Hitler happened to Germany. They’ve never forgotten that brutal lesson.

    • independent says:

      By saying the whole situation is out of control and that there is out of control violence on both sides is a separate issue from choosing one side or the other. I don’t choose any side, they are all morons for seeking violent confrontations and white supremacists are morons every day of their lives.

    • David Gray says:

      Hitler happened in large part because the state indulged activities which closely resemble those of Antifa.

      • You’re saying Antifa has led the country to experience a total national humiliation in a major war and is causing an economic collapse that will lead to the rise of a fascist state? This is a statement that really needs explanation.

        I would genuinely like to hear this theory.

        • David Gray says:

          Hey, if you want to defend the use of violence to shut down speech you oppose be my guest. We won’t be surprised.

          • Norshorguy says:

            Mr. Gray, I would also like to hear your response to Gerald’s point. It’s a shame that you must revert to the “Hey, be my guest” nonsense. So, anyway, go on…

  17. If a town or towns in our area of the country granted permits for the same type of nazi, fascist, white supremacists, nationalists to hold their poor white pity party and they came in militia gear heavily armed, carrying torches and proceeded to beat, spray anyone who taunted them for shouting “Jews will not replace us”, heil Hitler and other hate speech, how would the town and surrounding area locals react. I’d be shouting “Get out of my town” too.
    What happened in Charlottesville can happen anywhere. We are not immune.
    We may have a high white population but in case no one has noticed, we are becoming more diverse all the time. I see more and more blended families and non-white families every time I am shopping. More and more white families are not so white anymore. We have friends, co-workers, family, schoolmates, etc that are not lily white. People here would be just as outraged and upset as people in Charlottesville and the rest of the country. I believe most of us would not be stopping to debate who is more violent, the people who come to town specifically to intimidate and beat up people who jeer at their hate or the people who don’t want that filth touching their town and residents.

  18. David, you just keep telling yourself that and stay in your “safe” place.

    • David Gray says:

      “kissa” says free speech is only for speech she agrees with. Ernst Rohm felt the same way.

      • Norshorguy says:

        David, protesting (with proper permits, I might add) is not impinging on anyone’s free speech. And let’s be completely daft: who really sides with Ernst Rohm? Kissa or the Nazi’s at Charlottesville? That should be an easy one to answer. What is quite telling is your need draw a moral equivalency between (legally permitted) counter-protesters and Nazi’s. Should be a no-brainer. After all, David, it was you who said this on this website: “I am willing to enter discussion with people who are not applying reason to the topic at hand but I am not willing to with people who have shown themselves to be dishonest. (4/6/17)” Since, you’ve proven dishonest about counter-protesters’ permits and disingenuous concerning Nazi’s.

  19. “Hitler happened in large part because the state indulged activities which closely resemble those of Antifa.”
    How about elaborating on that statement, Mr Gray ?

  20. In the end, I remain puzzled and disturbed by the apparent need of our local far right to defend the Nazis and Klan.

    Presentation of false analogies and distractions from the issue, cherry picking of occasional facts from amidst whole articles that disagree with their point of view, half understood or distorted history, and outright lies gleaned from right wing sources that make up most of their supposed news do not change the facts in this case.

    I will repeat that this is not a left wing or liberal view. This is the view of essentially all of the respected leaders of the Republican Party, high ranking members of the administration, law enforcement officials from the local to the national level, and major business leaders who are life-long Republicans.

    To say that the United States has a very problematic history on the issue of race is not at all controversial. However, in the 21st century we are making progress, albeit by slow, lurching, and stuttering steps and with frequent backsliding, toward actually making our country meet the ideals that the founding fathers articulated but could not make themselves practice. This progress is being met by numbers of white people who are pushing back vigorously, demanding that the country return to the era of white privilege and arguing that to extend rights to non-whites is to persecute whites. We are seeing that push back here.

    I will give the benefit of the doubt to the local people, and suggest that they are merely caught up in political rhetoric and partisanship — “my faction right or wrong” — not really expressing support for the brutal racism, anti-semitism, and violence that the extremists they are giving shelter to represent.

    However, this is not a trivial issue. To allow organized fascism, white supremacy, anti-semitism, and sexism a legitimate role in our political discourse is heading down a deadly path that could destroy our country and our democracy. Contrary to what has been said above, the true history of the rise of the Nazis in Germany is a history of ordinary conservatives, with their country stuck in a deep financial depression and having been defeated in a major war and humiliated in the peace that followed, choosing to grant political legitimacy to what had started as an obscure faction of street thugs and allow them to play a full role in the politics of the country. The rest is history.

    In the end treason and rebellion are treason and rebellion; racism, anti-semitism, and sexism are racism, anti-semitism, and sexism; and assault and murder are assault and murder. They should not be tolerated on either the right or the left, but as the FBI has pointed out, it is the right that is having to deal with factions that embrace those values, and has the task of excluding them from their party and from their thought. Rational Republicans, in and out of government, have been very vocal in doing so, and in doing so have embraced their essential Americanism and patriotism. The fringe is having more problems, and as such deserves to be even further marginalized.

    • independant says:

      You my friend are missing the point entirely and talking past your intended audience. I know you what to pigeon hole everyone who thinks both the extreme left and the alt right groups are out of control as racists. I am sorry to let you down but your so blinded by your partisanship your missing the fact that everyone is agreeing with you that a white supremacist by definition is a moron. However that moron has the right to speak and prove that he is an idiot. At the same time anyone who wants to protest against these creeps has the absolute right to do so and I encourage it. However if you are going to hold a counter protest go through the process correctly and don’t wear masks, destroy property or attack people with physical violence. Both sides participated in violence and that is not in dispute. That is why I feel both groups share some responsibility for what happened.

      • Amen…and so common sense clear.

        • Let me just show you how it’s done, so you can learn:

          “Carrying a Nazi flag or any other symbol of white supremacy is a hateful act that cannot be morally defended, least of all by the leader of a diverse nation still healing from its original sin of racist slavery. Racists may have a constitutional right to express their repugnant ideas. But the rest of us have a duty to affirm and defend the values — the moral, political and religious values — that have helped Americans overcome violent racism at home and abroad, in war and in peace, for generations,” — Senator Mike Lee, R-Utah, often described as the most conservative person in the Senate.

          “We should call evil by its name. My brother didn’t give his life fighting Hitler for Nazi ideas to go unchallenged here at home. Their tiki torches may be fueled by citronella but their ideas are fueled by hate, & have no place in civil society.” — Orrin Hatch, R-Utah, President Pro Tem of the Senate and the most senior elected Republican in the Federal Government.

          “This isn’t a time for innuendo or to allow room to be read between the lines. This is a time to lay blame. This president has done an incredible job of naming terrorism around the globe as evil. He has said and called it out time and time again. And this president needs to do exactly that today.” — Senator Cory Gardner, R-Colorado

          “No, not the same. One side is racist, bigoted, Nazi. The other opposes racism and bigotry. Morally different universes.” Mitt Romney, Republican Presidential Candidate and former Governor of Massachusetts.

          So common sense clear.

          Go home. Practice. Then when you are ready, you can post.

          • “I just did something fascinating. I just re-watched the President’s entire 14-minute impromptu news conference at Trump Tower on Monday that sparked all the latest barrage of anti-Trump screeds from the left media that will criticize him every day, no matter what he does, augmented by the “Never Trump” Republicans and neo-conservatives who will not rest until they can re-conquer the political party they lost because of three terms of two failed Bush presidencies, followed by the two failed Presidential candidacies of Sen. John McCain and of Gov. Mitt Romney.

            This was not the reportage about the conference, but the entire 14 minutes unedited, uninterrupted. I found myself agreeing with his every word. I did not find his tone or demeanor “unpresidential” in the least. He sharply and explicitly condemned the Nazis and White Supremacists unequivocally. He also condemned the extreme leftists who pre-meditatedly came armed with weapons to smash up a demonstration that, rightly or wrongly, had been granted a legal permit. Meanwhile, the Antifa Alt-Left thugs came with flame-throwers, bats, and shields, and they came to fight. All the while, the police did nothing for much too long. Chaos and violence ensued.” – Ranger 47, R-Iron Range

  21. You know the old joke: What’s the definition of a racist? It’s a conservative who is winning an argument.

  22. I’m going to have to archive this entire conversation so Indy and R47’s comments can be read over ominous music in a future documentary about whiny ass Nazis and the people who are glad they filled out the proper paperwork.

    • independent says:

      I’m disappointed, I even tried explaining my disgust with the entire situation on both sides very slowly and as clearly as I could. If that is your smart ass comment response I obviously failed in communicating my point. Violence initiated by any group when not physically attacked first is wrong. The white supremacists are all dirt bags, period, end of thought. Please be intellectually deep enough to understand what people are saying.

  23. Man, Ranger really does live wrapped in cotton batting. A shame, really. However, if one wants to be on the side of fascism…
    Kudos to Gerald for his always very well- presented factual posts.

    • The truth, whole truth, and nothing but the truth Jackie…

      Say, just as an aside…back in the day, our high school (along with the then Itasca Junior College), put on a musical every other year. I was very fortunate to be in two of them. One was Finian’s Rainbow, great musical. My part that year?…a member of the Negro trio who sang “The Begat”…black face paint and all!

      Hopefully, me having this first hand early on experience of what it’s like to be a minority, helps you understand where I’m coming from..

  24. joe musich says:

    Tell me what is the reason that the topic of the article “Don’t Be A Sucker” was made ? And while your at it head up to Mpale Hill Cemetery and walk barefoot through the white crosses. While there stop before the WW2 graves and strike up a conversation with the spirits of each. And ask them questions about the reason they did what they did ? And let me know what they say. Please.

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